Gaea Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 I agree...thats why you go with the nullifying field
Heridfel Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 Or enough ranks of Adaptation - it doesn't always give Immunity, after all, and it makes me think of Darwin, the Evolving Boy, which is the coolest new Marvel character I've seen in years. Much better than Amadeus Cho. (Of course, in that case, Adaptation would probably give Power Resistance, which is an extra on Nullify, but there you are.)
Heridfel Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 Or enough ranks of Adaptation - it doesn't always give Immunity, after all, and it makes me think of Darwin, the Evolving Boy, which is the coolest new Marvel character I've seen in years. Much better than Amadeus Cho. (Of course, in that case, Adaptation would probably give Power Resistance, which is an extra on Nullify, but there you are.)
Heridfel Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 Or enough ranks of Adaptation - it doesn't always give Immunity, after all, and it makes me think of Darwin, the Evolving Boy, which is the coolest new Marvel character I've seen in years. Much better than Amadeus Cho. (Of course, in that case, Adaptation would probably give Power Resistance, which is an extra on Nullify, but there you are.)
Barnum Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 Immunity (women) isn't exactly by the rules, but if you assumed that it meant you were immune to any effect directly caused by a woman, then that would probably be about 40 pp. I think that's a bit off. To be immune to every effect (a silly notion to be sure) would be somewhere around 170 PPs: Immunity 80 (all damaging effects), Immunity 90 (All saves). Why would flawing that to women somehow get it down to 40 points. 85 would be much more like it. Limited: Women seems like a text-book case of a -1 Flaw to me. Limited: Only on modern tech seems more like a -2 flaw to me. That's why I'd say somewhere around 40 PPs would be right. I'd call "technological" a very common power descriptor, which means it'd cost 20 pp for that part of the immunity. I could live with a 20 point immunity if that would include passive effects ( like being able to walk through force field walls. Would that be covered? I be very hesitant to approve immunity to such a broad descriptor for only 20 PPs. An no, Immunity makes you immune to effects used on you. It doesn't affect the operation of someone else's powers. They still function normally. The gun still fires and the bullets still hit you. You are just immune to the damage from them. If you have Immunity (Fire), that does not allow you to punch a hero with a fire based force field and bypass it. It just means that when he blasts you with a fire blast, you are undamaged. In the same way, if you had Immunity (Cosmic Power), a cosmic power blast wouldn't hurt you, but a hero with a cosmic power based boost could still boost his strength and slap the crap out of you. You aren't immune to the slap (normal physical damage), and the boost wasn't an effect that was used on you. Even if you had Immunity (technology), a robot could still pick up a sword and stab you with it. I agree...thats why you go with the nullifying field I think that's pretty reasonable for what he's trying to do.
Barnum Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 Immunity (women) isn't exactly by the rules, but if you assumed that it meant you were immune to any effect directly caused by a woman, then that would probably be about 40 pp. I think that's a bit off. To be immune to every effect (a silly notion to be sure) would be somewhere around 170 PPs: Immunity 80 (all damaging effects), Immunity 90 (All saves). Why would flawing that to women somehow get it down to 40 points. 85 would be much more like it. Limited: Women seems like a text-book case of a -1 Flaw to me. Limited: Only on modern tech seems more like a -2 flaw to me. That's why I'd say somewhere around 40 PPs would be right. I'd call "technological" a very common power descriptor, which means it'd cost 20 pp for that part of the immunity. I could live with a 20 point immunity if that would include passive effects ( like being able to walk through force field walls. Would that be covered? I be very hesitant to approve immunity to such a broad descriptor for only 20 PPs. An no, Immunity makes you immune to effects used on you. It doesn't affect the operation of someone else's powers. They still function normally. The gun still fires and the bullets still hit you. You are just immune to the damage from them. If you have Immunity (Fire), that does not allow you to punch a hero with a fire based force field and bypass it. It just means that when he blasts you with a fire blast, you are undamaged. In the same way, if you had Immunity (Cosmic Power), a cosmic power blast wouldn't hurt you, but a hero with a cosmic power based boost could still boost his strength and slap the crap out of you. You aren't immune to the slap (normal physical damage), and the boost wasn't an effect that was used on you. Even if you had Immunity (technology), a robot could still pick up a sword and stab you with it. I agree...thats why you go with the nullifying field I think that's pretty reasonable for what he's trying to do.
Barnum Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 Immunity (women) isn't exactly by the rules, but if you assumed that it meant you were immune to any effect directly caused by a woman, then that would probably be about 40 pp. I think that's a bit off. To be immune to every effect (a silly notion to be sure) would be somewhere around 170 PPs: Immunity 80 (all damaging effects), Immunity 90 (All saves). Why would flawing that to women somehow get it down to 40 points. 85 would be much more like it. Limited: Women seems like a text-book case of a -1 Flaw to me. Limited: Only on modern tech seems more like a -2 flaw to me. That's why I'd say somewhere around 40 PPs would be right. I'd call "technological" a very common power descriptor, which means it'd cost 20 pp for that part of the immunity. I could live with a 20 point immunity if that would include passive effects ( like being able to walk through force field walls. Would that be covered? I be very hesitant to approve immunity to such a broad descriptor for only 20 PPs. An no, Immunity makes you immune to effects used on you. It doesn't affect the operation of someone else's powers. They still function normally. The gun still fires and the bullets still hit you. You are just immune to the damage from them. If you have Immunity (Fire), that does not allow you to punch a hero with a fire based force field and bypass it. It just means that when he blasts you with a fire blast, you are undamaged. In the same way, if you had Immunity (Cosmic Power), a cosmic power blast wouldn't hurt you, but a hero with a cosmic power based boost could still boost his strength and slap the crap out of you. You aren't immune to the slap (normal physical damage), and the boost wasn't an effect that was used on you. Even if you had Immunity (technology), a robot could still pick up a sword and stab you with it. I agree...thats why you go with the nullifying field I think that's pretty reasonable for what he's trying to do.
eyeonthemountain Posted December 12, 2007 Author Posted December 12, 2007 I think that's pretty reasonable for what he's trying to do. Ok then, a how would I price a nullify effect in a radius around him? Would Nullfiying tech be a 1, 2 or 3 point base cost? I think 2, but tech might be too broad for that. I'm really not trying to break the game, but a 40 point immunity that only applies to effects that hits me seems rather extreme. But maybe immunity is weaker than the way I think it works and have been working it in my game.
eyeonthemountain Posted December 12, 2007 Author Posted December 12, 2007 I think that's pretty reasonable for what he's trying to do. Ok then, a how would I price a nullify effect in a radius around him? Would Nullfiying tech be a 1, 2 or 3 point base cost? I think 2, but tech might be too broad for that. I'm really not trying to break the game, but a 40 point immunity that only applies to effects that hits me seems rather extreme. But maybe immunity is weaker than the way I think it works and have been working it in my game.
eyeonthemountain Posted December 12, 2007 Author Posted December 12, 2007 I think that's pretty reasonable for what he's trying to do. Ok then, a how would I price a nullify effect in a radius around him? Would Nullfiying tech be a 1, 2 or 3 point base cost? I think 2, but tech might be too broad for that. I'm really not trying to break the game, but a 40 point immunity that only applies to effects that hits me seems rather extreme. But maybe immunity is weaker than the way I think it works and have been working it in my game.
Toptomcat Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 It's not so much that Immunity absolutely must work as the way we're describing it in all M&M games- it's just that this is a big PBP game, where GM intervention is bound to be rather loose just because we don't have enough of them to closely watch everything. We are admittedly conservative, but out of neccesity.
Toptomcat Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 It's not so much that Immunity absolutely must work as the way we're describing it in all M&M games- it's just that this is a big PBP game, where GM intervention is bound to be rather loose just because we don't have enough of them to closely watch everything. We are admittedly conservative, but out of neccesity.
Toptomcat Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 It's not so much that Immunity absolutely must work as the way we're describing it in all M&M games- it's just that this is a big PBP game, where GM intervention is bound to be rather loose just because we don't have enough of them to closely watch everything. We are admittedly conservative, but out of neccesity.
Barnum Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 I'm really not trying to break the game, but a 40 point immunity that only applies to effects that hits me seems rather extreme. But maybe immunity is weaker than the way I think it works and have been working it in my game. Look at the other broad examples for clarification. Immunity to all physical damage is 40 points. Immunity to all energy damage is 40 points. Immunity to saves are 30 points each. And you want to buy an immunity that will make you immune to about 25% of all physical and energy damage, and Fort, Reflex, and Will saves in our game. I think 40 points is extremely generous. Ok then, a how would I price a nullify effect in a radius around him? Would Nullfiying tech be a 1, 2 or 3 point base cost? I think 2, but tech might be too broad for that. Yeah, the jump between 2 and 3 is too great. Obviously Tech is far more broad and common than "Fire," but it is not quite "all" either. If allowed at all, it would have to be 2 points. If you wanted it to be a "natural ability" that works all the time (even if you were stunned or unconscious) with no chance of "missing" an effect, it would be: Nullify 10 (All technological effects, 2 PPs/rank) [Extras] = 51 PPs. *Personal means that it only nullifies the effects with respect to you (like immunity). You would still have to make an opposed check to nullify effects that were greater than 10 ranks. That's expensive, and in some ways it doesn't work as well as the Immunity you want. That should tell you something.
Barnum Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 I'm really not trying to break the game, but a 40 point immunity that only applies to effects that hits me seems rather extreme. But maybe immunity is weaker than the way I think it works and have been working it in my game. Look at the other broad examples for clarification. Immunity to all physical damage is 40 points. Immunity to all energy damage is 40 points. Immunity to saves are 30 points each. And you want to buy an immunity that will make you immune to about 25% of all physical and energy damage, and Fort, Reflex, and Will saves in our game. I think 40 points is extremely generous. Ok then, a how would I price a nullify effect in a radius around him? Would Nullfiying tech be a 1, 2 or 3 point base cost? I think 2, but tech might be too broad for that. Yeah, the jump between 2 and 3 is too great. Obviously Tech is far more broad and common than "Fire," but it is not quite "all" either. If allowed at all, it would have to be 2 points. If you wanted it to be a "natural ability" that works all the time (even if you were stunned or unconscious) with no chance of "missing" an effect, it would be: Nullify 10 (All technological effects, 2 PPs/rank) [Extras] = 51 PPs. *Personal means that it only nullifies the effects with respect to you (like immunity). You would still have to make an opposed check to nullify effects that were greater than 10 ranks. That's expensive, and in some ways it doesn't work as well as the Immunity you want. That should tell you something.
Barnum Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 I'm really not trying to break the game, but a 40 point immunity that only applies to effects that hits me seems rather extreme. But maybe immunity is weaker than the way I think it works and have been working it in my game. Look at the other broad examples for clarification. Immunity to all physical damage is 40 points. Immunity to all energy damage is 40 points. Immunity to saves are 30 points each. And you want to buy an immunity that will make you immune to about 25% of all physical and energy damage, and Fort, Reflex, and Will saves in our game. I think 40 points is extremely generous. Ok then, a how would I price a nullify effect in a radius around him? Would Nullfiying tech be a 1, 2 or 3 point base cost? I think 2, but tech might be too broad for that. Yeah, the jump between 2 and 3 is too great. Obviously Tech is far more broad and common than "Fire," but it is not quite "all" either. If allowed at all, it would have to be 2 points. If you wanted it to be a "natural ability" that works all the time (even if you were stunned or unconscious) with no chance of "missing" an effect, it would be: Nullify 10 (All technological effects, 2 PPs/rank) [Extras] = 51 PPs. *Personal means that it only nullifies the effects with respect to you (like immunity). You would still have to make an opposed check to nullify effects that were greater than 10 ranks. That's expensive, and in some ways it doesn't work as well as the Immunity you want. That should tell you something.
Gaea Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 I forgot the continuous in my build....I knew i was missing something. but this Nullify does work on things like cameras....because while something like a Camera isn't a power per say....It is an EFFECT.
Gaea Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 I forgot the continuous in my build....I knew i was missing something. but this Nullify does work on things like cameras....because while something like a Camera isn't a power per say....It is an EFFECT.
Gaea Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 I forgot the continuous in my build....I knew i was missing something. but this Nullify does work on things like cameras....because while something like a Camera isn't a power per say....It is an EFFECT.
Barnum Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 I forgot the continuous in my build....I knew i was missing something. but this Nullify does work on things like cameras....because while something like a Camera isn't a power per say....It is an EFFECT. I think that's right as long as . . . 1) The camera isn't rendered inoperable. It just doesn't work on the player with the Nullify. 2) The camera is within the 50' radius of the Nullify effect.
Barnum Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 I forgot the continuous in my build....I knew i was missing something. but this Nullify does work on things like cameras....because while something like a Camera isn't a power per say....It is an EFFECT. I think that's right as long as . . . 1) The camera isn't rendered inoperable. It just doesn't work on the player with the Nullify. 2) The camera is within the 50' radius of the Nullify effect.
Barnum Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 I forgot the continuous in my build....I knew i was missing something. but this Nullify does work on things like cameras....because while something like a Camera isn't a power per say....It is an EFFECT. I think that's right as long as . . . 1) The camera isn't rendered inoperable. It just doesn't work on the player with the Nullify. 2) The camera is within the 50' radius of the Nullify effect.
Heridfel Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 I think that's a bit off. To be immune to every effect (a silly notion to be sure) would be somewhere around 170 PPs: Immunity 80 (all damaging effects), Immunity 90 (All saves). Why would flawing that to women somehow get it down to 40 points. 85 would be much more like it. Limited: Women seems like a text-book case of a -1 Flaw to me. Limited: Only on modern tech seems more like a -2 flaw to me. That's why I'd say somewhere around 40 PPs would be right. I was going the other direction. A very common power descriptor is supposed to cost 20 pp. Going up to "women" seemed like it would cost twice as much, since I was assuming that it only protected against direct effects. The character with the immunity wouldn't be affected by a woman punching him or hitting him with some sort of Blast, but causing indirect harm (like blasting the ceiling above that character, causing it to cave in on top of him) would still work. If you were also protected against indirect harm, then 85 points is probably more appropriate.
Heridfel Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 I think that's a bit off. To be immune to every effect (a silly notion to be sure) would be somewhere around 170 PPs: Immunity 80 (all damaging effects), Immunity 90 (All saves). Why would flawing that to women somehow get it down to 40 points. 85 would be much more like it. Limited: Women seems like a text-book case of a -1 Flaw to me. Limited: Only on modern tech seems more like a -2 flaw to me. That's why I'd say somewhere around 40 PPs would be right. I was going the other direction. A very common power descriptor is supposed to cost 20 pp. Going up to "women" seemed like it would cost twice as much, since I was assuming that it only protected against direct effects. The character with the immunity wouldn't be affected by a woman punching him or hitting him with some sort of Blast, but causing indirect harm (like blasting the ceiling above that character, causing it to cave in on top of him) would still work. If you were also protected against indirect harm, then 85 points is probably more appropriate.
Heridfel Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 I think that's a bit off. To be immune to every effect (a silly notion to be sure) would be somewhere around 170 PPs: Immunity 80 (all damaging effects), Immunity 90 (All saves). Why would flawing that to women somehow get it down to 40 points. 85 would be much more like it. Limited: Women seems like a text-book case of a -1 Flaw to me. Limited: Only on modern tech seems more like a -2 flaw to me. That's why I'd say somewhere around 40 PPs would be right. I was going the other direction. A very common power descriptor is supposed to cost 20 pp. Going up to "women" seemed like it would cost twice as much, since I was assuming that it only protected against direct effects. The character with the immunity wouldn't be affected by a woman punching him or hitting him with some sort of Blast, but causing indirect harm (like blasting the ceiling above that character, causing it to cave in on top of him) would still work. If you were also protected against indirect harm, then 85 points is probably more appropriate.
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